A Clockwork Orange

Title: A Clockwork Orange
Author: Anthony Burgess
Pages: 240

Today's post is a little different. Bookworm and I have started our own book club. We both read A Clockwork Orange and here is the discussion that followed:
Discussion Questions:
1.) The copy I read did NOT include a glossary. Discuss the language Burgess invents in the book. Were you able to understand it? What was the writer’s purpose? How does it change the story?
2.) Talk about the title A Clockwork Orange, what does it mean?
3.) When the book was first released the last chapter (chapter 21) was not included for the U.S. editions. Discuss the last chapter. How does it change the story?When the book was first released the last chapter (chapter 21) was not included in the U.S. editions. Discuss the last chapter. How does it change the story?
4.) Discuss the importance of music and the connection Alex feels to it.
5.) Discuss Alex’s dream (page 36). Are they telling him something? Foreshadowing the future?
6.) Did you ever feel sorry for Alex? How does the writer accomplish making you feel for Alex when he is a villain?
7.) How do we punish Alex? How do we stop children from becoming like him? Is there a solution?
8.) How does society view violence?
9.) Discuss these quotes: “When a man cannot choose he ceases to be a man” and “What does God want? Does God want goodness or the choice of goodness? Is a man who chooses he bad perhaps in some way better than a man who has goodness imposed upon him?”
10.) Final thoughts/feelings?

Bookworm:
1) My copy did not have a glossary either, and I think my experience with the story was better for it. Though I had a hard time at first, it eventually helped me to become fully involved in the world burgess created.
2) The title aptly describes the effect of the ludovico technique, but I do have trouble connecting the description of the orange (full of juice and sweetness) with Alex in particular.
3) When I read the author’s forward and realized that the 21st chapter was omitted from the us edition, i was shocked. without the final chapter, the story becomes something else entirely. had i not read the 21st chapter, i confess i probably would have hated the book. i need a bit of a happy ending, at least one with a shred of hope. however i do disagree with burgess chalking up alex's transgressions to youth. can one really be expected to believe that in any world rape, murder, and systematic beatings are really just a result of being young and bored?that the 21st chapter was omitted from the US edition, I was shocked. Without the final chapter, he story becomes something else entirely. Had I not read the 21st chapter, I confess I probably would have hated the book. I need a bit of a happy ending, at least one shred of hope. However I do disagree with Burgess chalking up Alex’s transgressions to youth. Can one really be expected to believe that in any world rape, murder, and systematic beatings re really just a result of being young and bored?
4) Alex’s love of music was something that helped me to see him as a human rather than the personification of evil.
5) In regard’s to Alex’s dream: It definitely foreshadowed the future, but was a little obvious for my taste. I think he reader can be trusted to pick up on the coming revolt of Alex’s droogs without the dream paving the way.
6) Nope, I can’t say I ever felt sorry for Alex. I could never get past what his victims must have felt. I disagreed with the technique to “cure” him, but my heart never hurt for him.
7&8) Punishment for Alex would have been prison, more specifically, a lifetime of solitary where the potential for violence against others is moot. To prevent children from becoming Alex lies with parental involvement. The downfall of Burgess’s society seemed to be the collective apathy toward violence; acceptance of a world without morals and one’s powerlessness to change it.
9.) I marked these same quotes in my copy! God wants us to choose our way, hence the free will he bestowed upon us. What satisfaction can he get from a people forced into submission? The man who chooses to do bad is not better than the man who has good imposed on him, but he is truer. At least in making a choice he is exercising free will, choice. I don’t want to live in a world of clockwork oranges. “Good” is subjective. I don’t want someone else’s ideas of good pushed upon me.
10.) My final thoughts on the book are this: I’m glad to have read it and liked it more than I thought I would have. It was a real horrorshow of a first book club choice!

Me:
1.) The language was my hardest barrier. I got two pages in and realized I had no idea what was going on and what I had just read. I nearly gave up then. And was I worried that I picked this book. So I went back and started over and read slower. The more I read the more I understood. Pretty soon I was able to translate almost anything said and I even found myself wanting to talk that way. At the end I realized this story couldn't be told any other way. The language gives the reader insights into the society and Alex and his droogs.
2.) To me "A Clockwork Orange" is taking something that is living and turning it into something mechanical. Turning humans into robots or turning oranges into mechanical pieces.
3.) Aww...the 21st chapter. It really does change the WHOLE story. Without chapter 21, Alex goes back to his life of violence. But in chapter 21, Alex begins to change. He even has the urge to father children. It shows how much a person can change from the ages of 15 to 18. How much life can change or a person can change. Although I tend to think it takes more than running into an old friend. I think chapter 21 is Burgess' version of a mid life crisis. Something that will change Alex.
4.) Music is what fuels Alex. It's his one true passion and love. It's the only thing he has any respect for. It is his being. That's why when the doctors use Beethoven to cure Alex it is a particularly brutal and cruel thing to do. They are taking the one thing from him he cares about. When they destroy his music, they destroy him.
5.) Alex's dreams always seem to have a prophetic property. I was struck by the image of Dim as a General. But I would have preferred to find out about Dim later, when Alex is "cured".
6.) I guess I'm a sucker. I felt bad for Alex. I think because Alex is our narrator and his victims never really have names, Burgess is able to make Alex human, so that I do feel for him when he's in prison and getting treatment.
7.) I think punishment and solutions are the hardest problem in the book. What is the solution? No idea so far. Alex seems to have nice, caring parents. Maybe one could work less? Stay home with him more? Or maybe if Alex had more access to more outlets for his energy? Maybe if he read or was encouraged to play an instrument? Punishment is a difficult subject to. Is putting someone in a prison that promotes violence, going to cure them of violence or just teach them new things? The Ludovico technique doesn't work either because it takes away the ability to do violence but doesn't cure the choice of action on violence. As with real life, this is a subject I can not find an answer to.....
8.) Violence begets violence. Hey are you a violent criminal? Come join the police squad! I also don't think it helps that there aren't really books in Alex's world. And newspapers and television are all run by the government. Thru the worldcast television, they tell people what to think. (Reminded me of the world in the book 1984 by George Orwell).
9.) Choice is what a person human. By removing choice humans become "clockwork" pieces. Robots. Zombies.
10.) Last thoughts? I ended up liking it more than I thought I would. Although I was quite worried about how you would like it. I didn't want to ruin our first book club pick. LOL! And I think Kubrick did an excellent job with the movie! Malcolm McDowell is the most perfectly casted Alex! That's all my droogie!